PR Powerhouse: Using the Media to Win Awards and Dominate Your HR Niche

In this episode I'm joined by Sara McCracken to discuss using PR strategically in your marketing and why it can be so important for your business.

So tune in and discover:

• Why strategically using PR in your marketing can be SUPER helpful when it comes to getting leads and clients.
• What awards to try and win - and which to avoid (You shouldn't try and win any and every award!).
• Where PR is useful for you - and where it isn't.
• How to use PR to extract every last benefit possible to grow your business and get leads and clients.
• The simple first step you need to take BEFORE even considering using PR in your marketing strategy - and which most HR Consultants miss out (to their detriment).

And much, much more.

So tune in now because this could be an EXTREMELY eye-opening episode for you.

And if you want to catch up with Sara you can download her free guide, "Five PR tips for success every business owner needs to know" here. 

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Transcript

Sara McCracken and Nick Poninski – 2024/11/11 13:55 GMT – Transcript

Attendees

Nick Poninski, Sara McCracken

Transcript

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: Hello there and welcome back to another episode of marketing made easy for HR consultants with me Nick Pinski.

Nick Poninski: Today we are very lucky we are joined by Sarah McCracken who is an awwinning PR and communication specialist with over 20 years of experience of developing strategies that affect change. Thank you for joining us today Sarah.

Sara McCracken: Thank you for having me,…

Sara McCracken: I am so pleased to be here.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, no problem. it's good to finally get you on the show because obviously we've been messaging a little bit…

Nick Poninski: since Atomicon to get you on to the show and here you are. Yeah, me too.

Sara McCracken: Yes, that was my first time at Atomic Con this year.

Sara McCracken: And I'm really looking forward to going back next year. So, hopefully we'll be able to meet in person and…

Nick Poninski: Me too. Yes. Yes.

Sara McCracken: some of your listeners will be there and we'll just be able to have a lovely big reunion.

Nick Poninski: It'll be fantastic.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: It's a really good little conference.

Nick Poninski: Yes.

Sara McCracken: Yeah, I mean just blown away I think by the caliber of the speakers.

Sara McCracken: Particularly loving you the people I follow on social media who were there in the room and being able to have those conversations, but also just meeting people I'd never met in real life. a lot of my LinkedIn contacts were there. We're practically chartering a plane from Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland at the minute to get there. so yeah, just brilliant to meet people.

Nick Poninski: Yes. Absolutely.

Nick Poninski: My favorite speaker was Jack Ram. Who was your favorite speaker?

Sara McCracken: I loved obviously Deina awesome.

Sara McCracken: H Theresa Heathwearing was another favorite. I do love her podcast as well and Simon Swe What is your dream?

Nick Poninski: Okay, that is so interesting…

Sara McCracken: He was really engaging as well.

Nick Poninski: because I have got no idea about any of those speakers. I know about ina obviously lovely Everyone knows Deina but yeah I don't know any of your speakers.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: I would see Jeff Raman talking about the celebrity treatment you should give your clients. Very interesting. He's going back this year.

Sara McCracken: So I'm looking forward to that. But I think that's maybe the power of the conference. There's something for everybody.

Nick Poninski: Yes. Yes.

Sara McCracken: So again, you can go your route. I can go mine. And then we meet at the coffee break and discuss ideas.

Nick Poninski: It's Such a good day. Love it. And I also love just how friendly everyone is, how exciting. it's got a feel to the conference, you're not sat around the board at any point.

Sara McCracken: Definitely not. And I mean, I had sort of seen and read about it, maybe the year or two previous, and I just had so much FOMO I had to book myself on. And I'm so glad I did. It's one of the best business decisions I've made. just to be able to be in a room with that many people and you sharing ideas, sharing you just discussing…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: who you've heard, what the speakers are saying. It's just really encourage everybody to sign up to that for next year.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, 100% we filmed that one.

Nick Poninski: But enough about that. Let's talk PR. So, I've obviously released a podcast about this before, but we're going to take that information that I shared previously. We're going to take it to the next level. Sarah is an expert with over 20 years of experience. So in your own words what is

Nick Poninski: All right.

Sara McCracken: What is PR indeed?

Sara McCracken: I mean obviously your target audience is not the whole world. Let me get that out there now. But the feedback I get a lot is up your PR. It's just sending out some press releases and getting in the media. And it is That's one of your tactics, but it's so much more than that. I mean obviously Nick, you're the marketing expert. That's your activities you undertake to make sales of a product or service advertising its close cousin but PR is about your reputation it's about what you say and what others say about you and it's about organically building your profile your reputation your credibility and it's really just a way to get that positive credibility positive reputation so that people are talking about you business and your

Sara McCracken: services when you're not in the room. And that's what we're all after. we want to be the to person,…

Nick Poninski: Mhm.

Sara McCracken: be it for PR or HR. and just you R is a way to do that. if you have a shoddy reputation, no amount of PR or spend is going to rectify that. but that's not where we're about here. You and your listeners, we're open, we're transparent, we're good at our jobs, and it's about building our positive credibility and reputation. so that's really R in a nutshell. PR will overlap with marketing. the tools and tactics are similar. You have all got social media. There'll be e newsletters all the rest of it. But your PR and your marketing approaches need to complement each other. And it's never too early to do PR for your business. And PR is not just for those great big faceless corporations either with the multi-million pound budgets. It's for small businesses,…

00:05:00

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: consultants, entrepreneurs from the very beginning. And again, it's about looking at just what opportunities are out there for you to raise your profile. And a structured approach will really help that

Nick Poninski: Nice. That is I like that.

Nick Poninski: I like that summary. That's very good. I think like you say, leaning into PR is very good. I think for me it's about It's about your brand. like you say it's your reputation but you as a business it's about sharing your message without sharing it's building awareness because obviously when you go to marketing there are different goals that you can try and facilitate when you're doing your lead gen or whatever it is and sometimes it is about getting leads and clients and sometimes it's just about building awareness for your business and obviously lead lends itself to that

Nick Poninski: Thanks.

Sara McCracken: absolutely and…

Sara McCracken: your PR approach it really needs to align to your business plan as well. you obviously have these goals that you want to achieve in terms of sales in terms of whatever it happens to be. So you then need to think what can do to support that. So again it's starting to filter. It's not doing everything but you've various tactics if you media relations that's the press side of things. You have your social media channels podcast coming on podcast is a brilliant approach. Your website networking stakeholder engagement. And if you think of all these things as credibility markers they all then start to add up. You've got your marketing touch points. How many touch points do you need to sell a service?

Sara McCracken: could be five, could be 35, who knows? But these all feed into that. and your credibility then all builds up. So if you were looking for an HR consultant, for example, I might Google consultant. I have had to look for an HR consultant in the past for something else I was connected with. So again, we were recommended somebody.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: I was able to go and research them online to see what they had done before and that all then starts to come up on the internet and you can then start to make a judgment on them. think wider than just getting in the press. Although that is really important and I'm happy to talk anybody through that, but think of those other opportunities as well that will just create that positive perception about your product, your service, whatever it happens to be.

Nick Poninski: Nice. Yeah,…

Nick Poninski: I like it. let's talk some more about that. Let's talk about because obviously being featured in the press is fantastic for your business right so I think we all know that depending on how you are covered yes I was just catching myself…

Sara McCracken: If we do crisis calms in another episode, Bye-bye.

Nick Poninski: then yes we don't want to be in bad press but good press right and I was just about to say the good press publications for me I wouldn't want to be covered in certain newspapers for example

Nick Poninski: simple. but yeah it is good because then you can stick it on your website and it is great for credibility i.e. if a trustworthy news source trusts you then Joe public should be able to trust you as well. So let's build on that Sarah. Why is important? Would I be able to trouble you for five reasons?

Sara McCracken: Five reasons why P are so important. …

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: I'm putting you on the spot here.

Sara McCracken: you are putting me on the spot.

Nick Poninski: I know because we prepared our questions.

Sara McCracken: I've got three good ones.

Nick Poninski: We said…

Sara McCracken: I know.

Nick Poninski: why is it important? But I thought I love a list.

Sara McCracken: I love a list, too. it's about becoming known. You count these, by the becoming known. How will you tell your story and position your business? that's really important for and again number two that's but then about as we've already said aligning it with your business planning and your business goals. So okay hold on you're doing the count for me that's good.

Nick Poninski: Yes. I'm doing the Okay.

Sara McCracken: So business plan, business goals, how will you then align your PR to that and become better known? So telling your story, positioning your business, talk about your background, clients you've helped, all the rest of it. important within that is identifying your target audience. So, who's your ideal customer? Who do you want to talk to? Is it an investor for example? is it an actual client? you need to think through who your target audience actually is and then build relationships with those people. build the trust with them.

Sara McCracken: 

Sara McCracken: So that could be through what we've already talked about, coming to speak on a podcast or being in the local paper or maybe speaking at a local business network event, whatever is appropriate for you. and again, it's really then about having your customers hear about you on TV or on the radio and not your rival because everybody's sort of sitting back waiting for the PR to happen to them, but you have to be quite proactive in going out after it as And there's, things we can talk about connected with that as tell you how to write press releases, how to make sure you can cut through the noise in the journalist's inbox from there. So, they'll help you increase your visibility,…

00:10:00

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: you and your reputation and ultimate will lead to sales. it's not as direct as marketing perhaps where you've got, your clickthrough rates,…

Nick Poninski: No, but it is important.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, me too.

Sara McCracken: but again, it's that wider reputational piece as well. And you touched there on I've lost count by the way and how many things I've done. But you touched there about the good press and the bad press. good. it's not so much I don't want to be in this paper. I don't want this type of story about me potentially because a lot of different papers have quite big readerships or quite big online audiences at the minute. So, it's thinking through how can you constructively and positively put forward your story. It could be as simple as maybe doing a 10 tips every HR consultant needs to think about in an appropriate magazine or obviously you're faced with more of a crisis situation or a negative reputation situation. We would take a different approach to that. So yeah, it really just depends.

Sara McCracken: But yeah, Set your PR plan around that. Identify your audience.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: Build relationships with them. And then proactively go out and seek the coverage that you would like.

Nick Poninski: No, I like that.

Nick Poninski: I think it's very key as well is what you're talking about there is when you're saying it should be part of your wider goals. for some people listening along to this PR is not the right way for them. it isn't for everyone. there are so many different ways that you can go about marketing your business, sharing yourself, positioning yourself. POI might not necessarily be the way forward for you and there's nothing wrong with that. But if it is part of your overall goal to I don't know become the number one HR consultant for local garages in the UK for example then PR is probably very important to you because if that's one of your lofty goals then how do you become number one?

Nick Poninski: You need to spread your message and PR is very effective at that, right?

Sara McCracken: Absolutely. Yeah.

Sara McCracken: I mean, just think reputation first and foremost and then everything that you're doing in and around that. So, even from what are you posting in social media that has a potential impact on your reputation? If you were say consulting as an HR consultant working maybe with a larger organization, I'd be going and asking what's your social media policy for staff? how is that impacting in the reputation of the business? if you're working with a charity, is what they're putting out politically neutral. So, these are all sort of things that you could be asking as an HR consultant going into an organization to work with.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: And again, it all links back to that public perception of you and your reputation and credibility. Here we go.

Nick Poninski: Nice. I like it.

Nick Poninski: So, I think let's go to the big question. Sarah, how can winning awards help you in your overall PR strategy?

Sara McCracken: That is an excellent question.

Sara McCracken: I mean, I mean, I am really proud to say that I am an winning R practitioner. I mean, it took me 20 something years to get one.

Nick Poninski: Thank you.

Nick Poninski: god.

Sara McCracken: And again, it's back to your overall PR approach. you can't just send out a press release today and hope that it's going to land. You need that ongoing sustained relationship building with the media, with journalists, with your PR planning. And awards are a tactic if you like of PR. So you've set what it is you want to achieve through PR and communications. You might think, "Yep, I think entering some local awards or UKwide award, whatever they happen to would be really effective in doing that." And they do provide that really good opportunity for raising your profile, for showcasing what it is you do and showcasing how successful you have been.

Sara McCracken: So that when you're asked further down the line of what have you done, they said I have won X Y and Zed awards for HR consulting or whatever it happens to be and that then adds to your credibility.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: So they do have a role to play in terms of your PR approach.

Nick Poninski: I agree.

Nick Poninski: So yeah, I think winning awards is definitely super important if you've got that desire to have your brand awareness out there, to have people recognizing you. If you want to be the number one HR consultant for local garages, winning awards, those are super important to you. So yeah, it's definitely something to consider. So let me ask you the next question. There are loads of awards out there that people can nominate themselves for that they can win. I see it on LinkedIn all the time. Someone's won business person and you're like, " business person of the year."

Nick Poninski: and you lean forward in your seat and then you sit back because I don't know the street that they live on has nominated them and they've won and the only other competition with Paul Macapp so what are the marker points of a good award Excellent.

Sara McCracken: very cynical.

00:15:00

Sara McCracken: Yeah, look, I'm agreeing 100% with what you're saying. there are so many awards out there that you could be winning. so I think before you go down that route, what I would be recommending is you take that step back and thinking which awards are credible. are they related to your professional body for example? Are they related to maybe your local business enterprise? could be a federation small business award could be, something highprofile like that. anybody can set up their own awards ceremony. Nick, you and I could decide to set one up tomorrow and it would be a money-making enterprise for us and we could have all sorts of business practices to encourage people to do that. But for me, it's about are the awards credible? Are they going to enhance my business? And will they reflect well on my business as well?

Sara McCracken: I have heard in the past of for example sustainability awards being sponsored by shall we say a beverage company that don't have the best pollution record. So again it's trying to tie those things up as Equally I know of some sustainability awards that are being led by somebody whose passion is to improve the world in terms of sustainability. so there's different ones out there. I would encourage you to research them and look who's behind them and maybe look at previous winners and do they sit well with your values I think would be the key from that as well. And I think there's other potential red flags as well. do you have to pay to enter? I don't necessarily have a problem with that.

Sara McCracken: So I'm a fellow of the charter institute of public relations and if I want to enter those awards I need to pay to enter and that's okay to an extent because of the credibility that comes but equally are you being asked to pay to play if are you then going to be stung by a very high ticket awards ceremony that you have to go to actually get your award are you…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: then going to be asked to pay to have the marketing assets there's a lot of red flags within there as well so I think you need to consider are again that reputational piece in terms of who is organizing the awards, what you're going to get out of it, how legit are should we say there as well. So again different things for different people…

Nick Poninski: I think Yeah,…

Sara McCracken: but Yeah.

Nick Poninski: I think that's something that pre people overlooks. I mean, I certainly do. But when you talk about winning the awards and they are that sustainability award and it's sponsored by a mega popular beverage company,…

Sara McCracken: Yeah. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: you might not think too much about that. But five years down the road, you might be thinking someone might come across you and want to hire you, but then they see that you're associated with that beverage maker and they be absolutely not.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: hard left, and…

Nick Poninski: by accident You've tarnished your reputation. So, it's super important. Yeah. I say, it's not something I thought about.

Sara McCracken: Yeah. Yeah.

Sara McCracken: And I think as well you'll see them as well occasionally. Do you know maybe more local ones and you put in submissions and then suddenly your friends on Facebook are all asking you to vote for them and click here because most number likes is going to win again. Is that really based on a significant amount of effort in terms of your nomination submission? Is it being judged by a group of your peers for example or is it just a popularity contest in social media? I would have a few warning bells about those ones as well I have to say. again more sort of popularity or vote counting ones. yeah so lots to think about but equally there are some really good awards out there.

Sara McCracken: And I would be looking at,…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: the reputable source. Is it your professional body? Is it, again, back to the local business enterprise. You see newspapers running business awards as well because then obviously they have a good reputation behind them as well. and again, what is that sort of long-term value the award is going to give to you? as well, is it just going to be a quick hit or is it something that you're really going to be proud of promoting like you've already said in sort of three to five years time?

Nick Poninski: Yes. I think one thing to think about as well from a marketing perspective and…

Nick Poninski: getting the most squeeze from that juice. I see people winning awards and…

Sara McCracken: Absolutely. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: then not putting it on their websites. they share it on LinkedIn, but then that's the end of it. And I think you need to put that on your website, the little photo collage of the night, link to, a press release about it.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: maximize the return on that, because if you get named as business person of the year for the small mediumsiz businesses federation or something, then put that right,…

Sara McCracken: Yeah. Absolutely.

Nick Poninski: left, and center everywhere on your website because that's a big,

00:20:00

Sara McCracken: It's just that classic repurposing your content and just re remembering and we're all guilty of this that just because you put something in LinkedIn and 25 people have seen it, they forget the next week. So you can continually pop that out as well. So yeah, no, absolutely maximize keep building that credibility piece as well.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: And then even if you have won the award, can you do a piece for the local paper for example? because you'll have a lovely photo of you all dressed up holding your award nicely.

Nick Poninski: Nice industry papers as well like…

Sara McCracken: Get that nice photograph, get it in the local papers, really keep pushing it. Absolutely. Exactly.

Nick Poninski: again if you're federation for small business winner award but then you save local mechanics what magazines do they have? So yeah, that's a great little tip there,…

Sara McCracken: Yeah. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: Nice.

Sara McCracken: I mean, that brings us right back to what PR is and identifying your target audience. so again, what magazine should you be in? What newspapers are relevant to you? And then just focusing all your efforts on those rather than a huge big scatter gun approach, which just doesn't really work for anybody.

Nick Poninski: So I guess that brings us to the last question. How can someone win an award?

Sara McCracken: We have to enter as first go off.

Nick Poninski: Step one.

Sara McCracken: Do you know you think about and it's like, Should I not enter? And again, you've got to think about your overarching business strategy. Will this enhance what I do? Will it add to my credibility? So, if you're ticking those boxes, then yes, take that next step of, finding the criteria, finding, what are the deadlines? That would be really important as well. And do you need a bit of budget for this as well. I mean, pursuing awards, it can be distracting from your day-to-day business. it can be costly. So, you need to balance all that in as well.

Sara McCracken: But in terms of how to write the award I'd be looking at choosing the right award to enter business specific really good reputation valued by your stakeholders and your target audience as well would be really important and then start to look at the criteria and I've actually been an awards judge for CIPR which is really eye opening. So you'll see in a lot of these things people are looking for examples of what it is that you've done. So there's no point in wasting your 350 words and this nice narrative of what I did in my holidays. That's the style I talk about it. You want to actually deliver I did this and it had an impact and I helped this many people and the outcome was a real change in practice or whatever it happens to be.

Sara McCracken: Craft that compelling narrative about…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: what you've done, who you've helped, and what the outcomes are and that's really going to help in terms of the judging process because they will have criteria to follow. But has your business solved a problem? Demonstrate the value of your work. Don't just write lots of words for the sake of it. and again then star or…

Nick Poninski: So we would talk about that being a star.

Nick Poninski: So situation,…

Sara McCracken: car. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: task, action, result. Yeah.

Sara McCracken: Or car contact action result if you're short on time. So yeah, very much But it's that evidence-based piece to really demonstrate what you've done. So you've got your right awards, you've crafted your lovely thing. Get somebody to read it s, check for spelling, make sure you've met the criteria and have included all the information that you need.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: There are consultants out there who can help write awards if you think you did need a bit of help. But equally, I think it's just having the confidence to do it because your business is really really good and you have every right to be entering these awards. so just make the submission and then sit back and wait for the call to see that you've been shortlisted. and…

Nick Poninski: Nice. this.

Sara McCracken: again going forward you can, start to talk about that you're a finalist in this award, even before you get to the actual award ceremony. being a finalist can be as important as being the ultimate winner because you then have those opportunities as well to raise your profile that, I'm a finalist and who's going to the award ceremony and shall we meet up beforehand. So again, back to that networking, that peer recognition as well.

Nick Poninski: I like Fair enough. that brings us nicely on to the end of the episode, Sarah.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: So, where would someone reach you if they want help with their PR,…

Nick Poninski: with their entry to award ceremonies? Amazing.

Sara McCracken: I spent an awful lot of time over on LinkedIn.

Sara McCracken: So, you will find me there. It's Sarah McCracken. That's s Amccen. so you'll find me there. I have a website which is www.theprclub.co.uk and I will have a download available for your listeners. it'll be five tips to do with PR and I will get you the link for that and pop that into the show notes later later on if that's okay as well. But, I have just going to say I have set up the PR club to help small businesses raise a profile through PR consultancy and training and it's what I absolutely love doing. So, I'm always open to a DM. Any question, I'm happy to organize it. And I do run some webinars on a regular basis as well…

00:25:00

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: where people can come and come and ask me anything. So, keep an eye out for those. Excellent. You're very welcome.

Nick Poninski: I might well pop along.

Nick Poninski: Love it. Okay. thank you for coming along and sharing all that wonderful information there, That's really insightful, really interesting stuff.

Sara McCracken: Thank you for having me and I'm sure we'll talk before at home, but we'll definitely see everybody there next year.

Nick Poninski: Yes. Yes. Can't wait. yeah. Hopefully for those listening along at home, that was an interesting episode. For me, that was really interesting and insightful. Loved either way, as ever, get marketing because without marketing, there's no sales and without sales there's no business. So, get marketing.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: to chop off the end of it. Bit of editing to do..

Sara McCracken: I know that'll be all right.

Sara McCracken: It's fine.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, it'll be Two minute of a job. At least I don't have to edit anything for the episode itself. That was good.

Sara McCracken: least you didn't swear halfway through it. Do you know what editing to do there?

Nick Poninski: Yes, that would have been a disaster.

Nick Poninski: I think I would have just started again. f*** it. Yeah, no problem.

Sara McCracken: No.

Sara McCracken: It's all good. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that. That was just Yeah. I can talk about for hours to come. So, it's all good.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, it was interesting. just because you think I mean I Because I've read a few books about it and I've been covered in the press.

Nick Poninski: So compared to my audience I know loads, but compared to you I know nothing. So that was really interesting.

Sara McCracken: Brilliant. Thank you.

Sara McCracken: Here any questions,…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: don't hesitate to ask.

Nick Poninski: What's the crack with your PR club?

Nick Poninski: What is that a membership? Mhm.

Sara McCracken: It will be eventually. I've been doing the training on the side for a year and a half. So, this is now the focus then on doing it for myself. So, going to focus on raising visibility through a R approach. so I'm working on that at the minute. So there'll be webinars connected with that again going through to be a 68week training program and then on the other stream if you then is working with businesses for I was in with MENCAT the other week doing a internal communications workshop with them for half a day and…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: looking at their key personas and all the rest of it or delivering press release training is the first staple as So kind of two streams is where I'm headed at the minute.

Nick Poninski: Fair enough.

Nick Poninski: Like it. Yeah.

Sara McCracken: Yeah, it's very exciting.

Sara McCracken: A bunch of ideas. It's just, the one at a time is the issue. So, at the minute, it's just all I mean, I'd call this more with university. So, I've got some opportunities with them lined up to go and speak to students, become an associate lecturer. I And again, P PR for me is so overlooked. So, I've done my MBA.

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: I'm giving off the course tutor. we've done all the marketing. We've done all the what are you going to do when your business leaders get hit by something crisis wise? who are they going to call? there's none of that. So, if you're developing your business leaders, then they need to start to know that. So, I'm working on that as well.

Nick Poninski: Who is your target audience?

Nick Poninski: Because I'm just thinking, how do you sell what you do?

Sara McCracken: The business side of things, I'm doing a lot through third parties through Westminster Insight. So delivering a lot of training through them through go succeed our local business enterprise funded model. and again the visibility side will be targeted at most probably more female entrepreneurs and…

Nick Poninski: 

Sara McCracken: business leaders, business owners that way because that's kind of where I gravitate to. But again it can all be tricked as we go along. It'll be an online model.

Nick Poninski: Interesting.

Nick Poninski: Nice. I like it.

Sara McCracken: Got to try these things. Yeah. What my big domino is.

Nick Poninski: You should I wonder about tying yourself in with because obviously they talked about the big domino last year at Atomicon. Pardon? …

Sara McCracken: Trying to think what me big domino is.

Nick Poninski: your big domino would be to get in front of everyone from Atomicon and say, "This is how you move your big domino domino."

Sara McCracken: Yeah. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: put that webinar on, post it, and get everyone to come along…

Sara McCracken: Yeah. need to figure out…

Nick Poninski: because I would love to know what my big domino is and how to move it.

Sara McCracken: what it is. I'm speaking at CPR conference this month, so hopefully that'll be a slightly smaller domino. but it all builds up. It'll all be fine.

Nick Poninski: Yeah. …

Sara McCracken: But yeah, there's definitely something for Atomic Con in terms of one of their fringe sessions because again, it's all social media. It's all marketing.

00:30:00

Nick Poninski: f*** that. charge people for coming along.

Sara McCracken: Yeah, that too. Yeah. Yep.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, f*** the fringe events. Don't do it. They give it away for free. that is my biggest lesson of 2024, putting on too many events for free.

Sara McCracken: Yep.

Nick Poninski: Which isn't necessarily a problem when you're trying to raise your profile, but if you've got an audience that are ready to buy,…

Sara McCracken: Start charging.

Nick Poninski: then charge them. Yeah.

Sara McCracken: Yep. Yeah.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: And I would give you a tener to come along to a webinar that said how to move your big domino 20 quid.

Sara McCracken: I going to make a note of that.

Nick Poninski: You should welcome.

Sara McCracken: Thank you very much. I need to go see the time is 3:00.

Nick Poninski: Yeah. I'm going to go to the co-workers and register and…

Sara McCracken: Yes, I am going to go into the sunshine and…

Nick Poninski: yeah I'm going to walk to the co work space.

Sara McCracken: get some vitamin D.

Nick Poninski: But I will get my bit and gee as well.

Sara McCracken: Brilliant. Listen, thank you so much. I really appreciate this. and…

Nick Poninski: Yeah, no worries. Thanks for joining me.

Sara McCracken: shout if I can help you in any way.

Nick Poninski: No, you are a very good guest. I'll give you that. Some people come on and** drone and I have to cut them off or move them along.

Sara McCracken: I'll maybe ask for testimony in LinkedIn. You can put that in. She didn't drone on.

Nick Poninski: Yeah, fair enough. No problem.

Nick Poninski: 

Nick Poninski: And we can leave each other testimonials on LinkedIn and…

Sara McCracken: We'll do that. worries.

Nick Poninski: you can leave me a positive review on my podcast.

Sara McCracken: I will find out how to do that. Definitely. Please do.

Nick Poninski: I'll sh the link for you. Bye.

Sara McCracken: No problem. All righty. Take care. Bye.

Meeting ended after 00:31:39 👋

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